tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post5955712355711390535..comments2024-03-14T18:56:31.716-05:00Comments on Two Catholic Men and a Blog: What If We Compare Marriage Rights to Voting Rights? Joehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13632007696351816323noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-60083872571220505192015-06-13T05:14:46.814-05:002015-06-13T05:14:46.814-05:00Beautiful and Valuable post.
May God open the eyes...Beautiful and Valuable post.<br />May God open the eyes of the blind...!Online Journalisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09126573886366564851noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-63059864951194831612015-06-11T21:11:00.591-05:002015-06-11T21:11:00.591-05:00Hi R1,
An interesting link.
Thanks for sharing.Hi R1,<br />An interesting link.<br />Thanks for sharing.Benhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11953563578914140396noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-64944457715383803542015-06-11T08:39:35.483-05:002015-06-11T08:39:35.483-05:00Here's a heterosexual couple in Australian who...Here's a heterosexual couple in Australian whose marriage has been affected by SSM.<br /><br />http://citynews.com.au/2015/gay-law-change-may-force-us-to-divorce/Rationalist1https://www.blogger.com/profile/05436700470084937357noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-63731980367827619232015-06-09T12:10:11.872-05:002015-06-09T12:10:11.872-05:00I enjoyed your essay. One of the difficulties is t...I enjoyed your essay. One of the difficulties is that it argues from logic, and the ssm movement is driven by sentiment and emotion. Logic is lost on them. They will listen and agree to what you say because it is logical, then they will say "You're probably right, but I feel that gays should not be treated unfairly." They seem to feel that "gay rights" are irrelevant to them personally.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-51819586119901098362015-06-04T16:20:59.769-05:002015-06-04T16:20:59.769-05:00When people begin to be prosecuted for not accepti...When people begin to be prosecuted for not accepting a delusional concept such as ssm, how is this not being affected? How am I not affected when I am called bigoted and hateful for believing and claiming marriage is between a man and woman only? When a delusion such as ssm is protected by law then we have a huge problem, especially for those of us that hold to reality which in this case is that marriage is a union of a man and woman for the purpose of procreation and establishing a stable relationship for children as well as being the foundation of communities. <br /><br />We can no longer depend on our Freedom of Religion to protect us. We can no longer abide by our conscience without defying the law. We can no longer choose not to participate in things that we deem sinful simply because of a delusion that is protected by law. <br /><br />Ssm can become the law of the land, but those of us that do not have our heads in the sand can never recognize it as a marriage. Those who wish to engage in ssm or support those that do can go ahead and do what they want but in return I expect them to respect my Freedom of Religion. And as far as I can see right now my right to live my conscience is being chipped away by a movement that is not based on reality.....but a delusion. When I am considered hateful for opposing ssm it affects my wife. When she is considered hateful for opposing ssm I am affected. Hence, our marriage is affected. <br /><br />So tell us. How are we unaffected by ssm? Bobbynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-25439037646229912382015-06-04T13:41:41.560-05:002015-06-04T13:41:41.560-05:00Gay marriage has caused even greater sexual confus...Gay marriage has caused even greater sexual confusion about the purpose of sex among people my wife and I both know. How to best deal with their confusion has put stress on my marriage. But perhaps my wife and I are the ones who are confused, right? We then we get into the mother of all questions “How do we know what’s true?”<br /><br />Furthermore, the question is not relevant. How something affects me personally not does make it objectively good or bad or even neutral. <br />Benhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11953563578914140396noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-3696011997499588132015-06-03T21:15:51.077-05:002015-06-03T21:15:51.077-05:00I never said Heterosexuals caused SSM. My commen...I never said Heterosexuals caused SSM. My comment was that all the things that you attributed to gay marriage have been "practiced" by heterosexuals for centuries. <br /><br />Can you name one way the gay marriage has actually affected your marriage or a marriage of someone you know? I've never had anyone come up with an answer.Michaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15109458923860112875noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-11535499794790489372015-06-03T10:19:50.858-05:002015-06-03T10:19:50.858-05:00“Heterosexuals have messed up many lives with thos...“Heterosexuals have messed up many lives with those vices.”<br />Agreed. Heterosexuals caused SSM. I did a post on that.<br />http://2catholicmen.blogspot.com/2013/07/heterosexuals-caused-same-sex-marriage.html<br /><br />“The Catholic church's teaching…”<br />When I talk religion, some say keep your religion out of this. When I make only secular arguments, like this post, the same people bring up religion. It’s fascinating.<br /><br />“For marriage is more than sex, it's companionship, love, sharing, and many things other than sex”<br /><br />Why issue a special license for this and give it a special name? Why sex? Why exclusive? Why two? Why permanent? Why property? Why government? Why rights? Why bother? Procreation links all these ideas. <br /><br />Our society is getting very proficient at making assertions & demands, but not so skilled at asking & answering “why”.Benhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11953563578914140396noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-30279529520280727492015-06-03T06:42:25.757-05:002015-06-03T06:42:25.757-05:00A civil marriage can be annulled if one person is ...A civil marriage can be annulled if one person is unable to have sex only if the other spouse did not know of this. Civilly couples can be married if the are unable to have sex and the marriage is civilly valid if they entered into this marriage with that full knowledge. The Catholic Church, however, forbid this marriage. I would suggest that this sanctioning of No Sex marriage (NSM) by civil authorities has done as much damage to OSM as SSM has.Michaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15109458923860112875noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-63184355452513224312015-06-02T21:33:25.750-05:002015-06-02T21:33:25.750-05:00"physically unable to have sex cannot be marr..."physically unable to have sex cannot be married, yet society allows that."<br />No it doesn't. Inability (or refusal) to consummate a marriage is grounds for anulling a marriage in secular courts.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-8148614094386675772015-06-02T19:50:51.401-05:002015-06-02T19:50:51.401-05:00I am thinking of the big picture. Fornication, d...I am thinking of the big picture. Fornication, divorce, etc. existed for years before SSM. Heterosexuals have messed up many lives with those vices.<br /><br />Governments and many religions have allowed marriage in situations where sex and procreation are not an option. The Catholic church's teaching is such that a person who is physically unable to have sex cannot be married, yet society allows that. For marriage is more than sex, it's companionship, love, sharing, and many things other than sex. <br /><br />What I have seen in the 10 years since gay marriage has become a fact here in Canada is many gay couples are settling down, making permanent commitments to each other, in some cases raising children and contributing positively to society.<br /><br />I can honestly not think of how gay marriage has affected my marriage in any way. I can think of many other factors in society that have an effect but not gay marriage. If you are married has it affected you?Michaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15109458923860112875noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-63176301750518595612015-06-02T15:58:51.813-05:002015-06-02T15:58:51.813-05:00I think we are at or very close to the point where...I think we are at or very close to the point where a rational discussion is over concerning ssm. Yes, as you say we must live the truth and proclaim it to all who will listen, but as we are fighting a spiritual battle of such enormity that again, as you said, fasting, prayer and love is the best recourse we have. Ben, as you mentioned in the comments in one or your replies to me in an earlier post, this whole movement is indeed demonic. There is no other way to explain the extremely short time it took to get us to this point. Bobbynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-28314272252423829002015-06-02T11:07:11.933-05:002015-06-02T11:07:11.933-05:00Hi Michael,
Stop and think of the big picture abou...Hi Michael,<br />Stop and think of the big picture about marriage in terms of permanence, sexuality and procreation. All three of these are intrinsically linked and trying to break them apart is intrinsically disordered and causes suffering for everyone.<br /> <br />How many people including countless children suffer and die because of fornication, divorce, abortion & STD’s? How much is poverty increased? It relates to sexual confusion. In legalizing SSM, governments are enforcing the idea that marriage, sex and procreation are NOT linked. This further extends the confusion. Removing the rational basis for a norm will erode adherence to that norm. The government is a kind of teacher with great influence on public institutions, and public institutions shape our ideas, and ideas have consequences. Benhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11953563578914140396noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-46238280251107901902015-06-02T08:26:24.857-05:002015-06-02T08:26:24.857-05:00"Where there is rage all reason escapes us.&q..."Where there is rage all reason escapes us."<br /><br />This is true! It seems that this is where we are at now in our country. So,..... How can we use reason at all to persuade people of the Truth- The Gospel. Reason is not wanted here. I suppose we must live Truth. This means as you rightly pointed out, that: "Those of us who oppose ssm (will continue to be) are being mocked, ridiculed, hated and in increasing number being persecuted and prosecuted. Fasting, prayer and love of others will be our best witness moving forward.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-73112488732356395162015-06-02T06:56:20.392-05:002015-06-02T06:56:20.392-05:00People who oppose SSM should not be mocked, even w...People who oppose SSM should not be mocked, even when they don't bake cakes or sell flowers to gays. For centuries gays were jailed and in some cases killed for their actions. Nothing comparable is being done today. I live in a country that has had gay marriage now for a decade and I do not see how it is affecting my marriage or the OSM of families or friends. <br /><br />I believe the fear is that as gays become more public, people get to know them as people, not as stereotypes one realizes that they are in many ways like us. Yes, different in their sexuality, bit essentially the same otherwise. And once that happens, as it has with most of the young generation, it becomes hard to think of their actions as :"intrinsically disordered".Michaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15109458923860112875noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-9409851443333640662015-06-02T04:57:17.505-05:002015-06-02T04:57:17.505-05:00"... but they have a right to their beliefs a..."... but they have a right to their beliefs and morals just like those denominations who oppose gay marriage."<br /><br />I agree but that is not what is happening. Those of us who oppose ssm are being mocked, ridiculed, hated and in increasing number being persecuted and prosecuted. I agree with your post Ben but if we think this whole issue about ssm is about marital rights we best think again. It is about destroying marriage and families rather than homosexuals gaining the same marital rights as heterosexual couples. Marriage is to be done away with. Destroy marriage destroy civilization as we know it. Sadly I think it is as simple as that. Where there is rage all reason escapes us and that is what we are seeing I believe. Thank youBobbynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8005473794963219887.post-7213629621755961092015-06-01T22:00:00.466-05:002015-06-01T22:00:00.466-05:00Many Christian denominations have no problem with ...Many Christian denominations have no problem with gay marriage and have been at the forefront in promoting it. They may be right or they may be wrong but the have a right to their beliefs and morals just like those denominations who oppose gay marriage. One could argue that allowing gay marriage for those denominations that are in favour of it is a promotion of religious liberty.Michaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15109458923860112875noreply@blogger.com